Its an interesting setup with everything from design through to milling the chassis to building the circuit boards being done in-house. The PSUs are available to match. Up to 4X DSD In that price range, you would be mad not to addthe MSB Premier DAC to your list as well. This latter recording gets played to death at shows, but that doesnt detract from it being a very good tune and a very good recording, though I have been known to take the piss a bit when it gets played for the tenth time in a day at audio events. With two prime DACs, we yield an unprecedented level of detail, reproducing the musicality, soundstage, and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. The Base module is used on the two lower DACs (including this one) and then the Preamp Output Stage for the top two DACs in the range. There are a lot of people that absolutely love the M-scaler. I like Aqua Formula xHD and Totaldac Six. DAVE stands for 'Digital to Analogue Veritas in Extremis', a moniker that best reflects the product's . Great Dac but for me a NOS DAC (Metrum Adagio) won the contest over all the others Dacs I have tried so far. The other thing I've learned about the Chord Dave is it can sound very different depending on the interconnect and/or power cord used. In my assessment the Makua offered a more open and spacious sound. There is the option to add a streaming module to the Discrete and if I was in the market for a digital streaming solution, then this is where I would be going. Still would like to listen to the Soulution 760 DAC, Mola Mola DAC, Trinity DAC, MSB Select DAC, and maybe the Light Harmonic Da Vinci DAC, Gryphon Kalliope DAC, TotalDAC of some kind, Phasure NOS1A DAC, Esoteric Grandioso DAC, TAD DA1000 DAC, Audionet DAC, Chord Dave DAC . this was how I originally decided to purchase the Select II as I was trying to hear another dac at shows that could do what I heard the Select II doing at a lower price. HiFiMan Ananda, SR Orange fuses, Taiko Audio Daiza platforms, Startech FMC optical network link, Oyaide EE f/s2.0 V2 mains spurs, Akiko Audio tuning sticks, GIK Acoustic TriTraps/panels. And thinking more about it, the differences at the time could have been small because the noise level in my system at the time of the comparison were relatively higher than they are now. The biggest question about this device is, Yeah listened to the same HEk V2 and Chord Dave with. Talking of cool lets talk about this remote. The MSB Discrete, as I mentioned, came with two power supplies but you can operate it with just one with the supplied doodad. If I had been responsible for coding that display I would never tell anyone. Toggle signature. Can't beat the form factor of it though, great for off a desk top. Digital Audio Forum: DAC, Transports, Digital Processing Forum, 4x20A circuits | Audioquest Niagara 3000 | Paul Hynes SR4T + HDPlex HD500 PSUs -> Music PC w/JCAT XE nic, HQPlayer, Roon, Tidal / Qobuz | HDPlex HD100 PSU -> OCX clock + EtherRegen | Aqua Acoustic Quality LinQ streamer | Aqua Acoustic Quality Formula xHD Rev. MSB Discrete Dac with one additional basic power supply. Wavedream only has a couple hours on it, but from the first note it Im getting a bit away from the review proper, but Im sure you can see why I have added that little diversion. JavaScript is disabled. RCA outputs with the optional output module Voltage: 3.57 Vrms Maximum Impedance > 600 High Gain setting. The MSB DAC comes with one external PSU as standard. The Merriam-Webster online dictionary tells me that the definition of high-fidelity (HiFi) is the reproduction of an effect (such as sound or an image) that is very faithful to the original and it would seem to be reasonable to assume that this is the goal of audiophiles around the world. And the Jeff Rowland Aeris DAC with new PSU. As a contented Qutest user, I would have hoped for "improved", performance from the Dave. Our digital testing has been done over the last 20 + years 5 other people who only have 2 things in common with our system. Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator, https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/absolute-top-tier-dac-for-standard-res-redbook-cd. The Pro USB is offered as a stand alone module for users who already have an MSB DAC that is equipped with a Pro ISL input as well as a starter kit with a Pro ISL input and everything you need to get up and running. Playing Gil Scott-Heron and Brian Jacksons Your Daddy Loves You from the Winter in America album gave me the same impression of a reach-out-and-touch soundscape with incredibly well-defined positions in the mix and a whole load of detail the over-driven sound of the electric piano at around a minute forty really stood out as being faithful to the recording; a case of high-fidelity highlighting a low-fidelity artefact? ), Chord Hugo 2 Review (Portable DAC & HP Amp), DAC Noise Modulation: Chord DAVE vs Topping DX7 Pro+, Digital To Analog (DAC) Reviews and Discussion, Amplifiers, Phono preamp, and Analog Audio Review. Thanks. It is worth every penny. So, essentially, around the back of this DAC we have XLR output modules, dual power inputs (more on this in a moment) the digital input module (XLR, RCA, and two optical), and the USB input. It's just more financially viable to me for the performance and price ratio. . Aurender N10 is still not a USB only dedicated streamer so you will not hear what USB audio is fully capable off through Ms/Dave. I cant help with comparisons of two of these DACs, but I did hear the Tambaqui up against the dCS Bartok and it was a pretty close call, but ultimately the dCS sounded more analogue and more immersive, I have heard the Dave and EMM Labs DAC2x up against aMakua that I subsequently purchased. Look, says I theres obviously a fault with this unit as its lighting up, I can see it on the network and I can send tunes to it via the Stack streamer and Roon! We went through everything and I was getting ready to pack it up and send it back when I reached around the back of one of the PSUs and switched it on MUSIC!!! Do diamonds shine on the dark side of the moon? I haven't heard MSB or theDenafrips DAC. The good DS (delta sigma) dacs that aren't hard or harsh, are a bit of a yawn, and lack bringing out the life (boogie factor) of the music, but in a . Founded in 2010 Whats Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. To my ears it makes music sound unnatural. will every hear. However, to get this level of separation and detail within the soundscape the DAC is clearly having a very important role to play. I'm really anxious to hear more opinions about this DAC and noticed that DAVE hasn't got a thread of its own (only together with Mojo). Since opening our doors in 1986, weve been driven by one goal: to craft an unrivaled listening experience for music lovers across the globe. JavaScript is disabled. The Hugo TT2 is intended to bridge the gap between the range topping DAVE and budget Qutest rack mounted offerings. Triangle Magellan Concerto 2< AQEverest< Vitus Audio SS-010 Mk2< AQDragon High Current< AQWELXLR< ChordQutestDAC w UpTone JS-2 & AQ Dragon Source < AQDiamond USB< InnuosPhoenix USBwAQ Dragon Source< AurenderN100H & AQ Dragon Source< NetGear GS105GESwitch w UpTone LPS1.2< Supra CAT8 Ethernet Music PC w/JCAT XE nic, HQPlayer, Roon, Tidal / Qobuz | HDPlex HD100 PSU -> OCX clock + EtherRegen | Aqua Acoustic Quality LinQ streamer | Aqua Acoustic Quality Formula xHD Rev. This all-American theme is continued in the companys PCB Shop where they use circuit boards produced for them in Silicon Valley, which are then made ready for the automated adding of the smaller components and hand-fitting bulkier components before washing and inspection. There are so. Whats Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. Analogue Volume Control 1dB from 0 to 106 Deactivable by menu, Dimensions ChassisWidth : 432 mmDepth: 305 mmHeight without feet: 51 mm. Up to 1km lossless transmission. Once you start playing a tune the DAC works out the sample rate and chooses the correct playback clock. Others might disagree but these are my findings. But even with great preamps, a great DAC in a low noise environment, will produce a more transparent sound going direct to the amps than through the preamp. Let us do the work of refurbishing and finding your current electronics a new hometheyll continue to be enjoyed for years to come. Different songs will sound better with different sources - Different horses for different courses. Stuart Smith finds out. To me, the instrumental timbre seems more accurate with DAVE than any other DACs I've heard. And this is where I had a problem with this DAC, though mostly the problem was of my own making. But MSB Select 2 is regarded by many as the best thats why for something 1/10 of the price to compete in anyones eyes is quite an accomplishment. Im participating to both learn and make suggestions where I have experience that may help. Of the ones you mentioned I'd be most tempted by the Emm Labs DAC 2x though if you can get a used higher-end Esoteric, you should jump on it. I've had some excellent preamps in my system (Dartzeel, Absolare, Robert Koda, Kondo). auditioned the Rockna Wavedream Edition DAC. You absolutely can say that you prefer other DAC's to the Berkeley Alpha Reference. It features the very best conversion technology available, using proprietary techniques never seen before, making DAVE the most advanced DAC/preamp amplifier in the world. I'm doing this off the top of my head. Its a clever thing meaning that their products are repairable and upgradeable for example, you can have a card that is set up for single-ended outputs or balanced XLR outputs (for review we have the balanced version). They are excellent pairing. In that price range, you would be mad not to add the MSB Premier DAC to your list as well. I wish you would have had the Totaldac D1 Seven to try. Who knows ?! Auction bid 7 150 25 . It may not display this or other websites correctly. I don't think any of us have heard the Dave, and we don't have any interest. It's UPDATE VIDEO THREE for the Chord Electronics DAVE DAC REVIEW I have spent a lot more time with the DAVE Dac, still using. When we set out to make the MSB remote, the design was built from the ground up. I can see the problem with this unit. Much appreciated. Whatever, the Discrete is a superb bit of kit that Id really love to take up residence in the system on a permanent basis, but thats not going to happen. Yes, definitely, as it is those extra tiny little bits of detail that adds the cherry on top of an already rather splendid slice of musical cake brought out on tracks like the audio show mainstay Keith Dont Go from Acoustic Live by Nils Lofgren. The Discrete DAC Features - MSB Technology The Discrete DAC Refined sound. Elegant design. $16K Signature DAC sound? It has the option for two PSUs and once you hear with both it becomes a necessity to have both. the Extreme has some special optimization for USB. We are - Up to 32 bit - 768kHz. Would I pay extra for the second supply? I have heard a lot of top DACs at shows or other systems but not in my own. The Discrete is around 11,000 whilst the Select is 120,750 with its power base. Never use!! MSB DACs also use a processing chip to handle oversampling and digital filtering (not sure if this chip is an FPGA or other type processing chip, but it is a high speed digital processing chip). The Premier is a super-high-resolution, completely silent, utterly dynamic component that lets music flow through it less hindered than through anything else I've heard. Thank you for posting! Can it output a Low or High Voltage on a single pin in a bitstream? Chord Dave DAC "Sealed Box Brand New" Never Opened !! Or arm yourself with a nice bottle of red and pay a visit to@Stereophilus. turns out that with the Extreme USB slightly pulls ahead of the Ethernet with the Renderer, then adding the Pro USB there is now a significant step up over the Renderer. Firstly, that was a very impressive list of high end components you have listened to. lastly; what I compare my MSB Select II to every day is my top level vinyl and top level reel to reel tape. We have what I consider to be a pretty resolving system, but we also listen to music a fair old bit for pure pleasure and so theres a valve amp currently feeding our chosen reference loudspeakers though thats not to say this system isnt highly resolving in its own right. You'll be shocked by how much you lose by going through a separate preamp. and build quality is also excellent. Personally, I think that both these standpoints have their merits and its going to be a case of you paying your money and you taking your choice. Were constantly improving digital input modules to stay at the forefront of the high-end audio industry, ensuring youre always equipped with the most current digital file formats and interfaces. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites. Besides that the MSB looks so much better. At this kind of price, it puts Chord DAVE as being direct competition and I said that DAVE was the best DAC Id heard back in 2018. Of course your opinion on sound quality is your own, and valid, but to suggest that the reason for the difference is because the Chord is an "FPGA DAC" is technically incorrect. Well build a personalized offer for your existing MSB products that count towards a new DAC or amplifier. You must log in or register to reply here. A fully balanced, ultra-high precision, discrete ladder DAC architecture ensures each note tells a story. The reasoning behind the two clocks dealing with different frequency families is that music is mostly recorded within multiples of the 44.1kHz family or the 48kHz family and having a clock dealing with each family minimises loss. A Chord DAC converts to analog via Chord's "Pulse Array DAC" which is a discrete circuit, similar to the discrete circuit used in the MSB DACs (but not the same). Watts is avidly not reading this in anticipation of the video version he won't watch. Btw, my MSB friend and I used the internal analog preamp for MSB and built-in digital preamp for DAVE. The MSB Renderer was developed using an in-house hardware design running an ultra low noise A5 processor for optimal audio playback performance. Get a Lampi Golden Gate Dac and match it with the RK5u4g rectifier and PX25 DHTs or the RK242 DHT. Amplification: Cyrus Mono x300Signatures. Funny how Rob Watts drones on and on about noise modulation, and then we see his product performing like this.. now one might not exactly call this noise modulation, but it definitely something to avoid, especially given the price tag. MSB Technology's Discrete DAC was the best DAC I'd heard in my systemuntil the MSB Premier showed up. It matches Chord Dave and Mscaler on dynamics with slightly more bass slam. I'll take a look, however I've heard they're on the warm side? Point 75 EmmLab Dac2 I paid 9K$ for this on 2010. Still, it's the way I prefer at this stage. Since the Topping D70s SINAD is ~120 dB and it costs ~$650, then given that "money is power" (as opposed to amplitude), I would expect the Chord DAVE SINAD to be at least 120 + 10*log($14,000 / $650) = 133.3 dB. It is my name after all! Can I ask how you procured all those DACs? CH Precision mono dac with clock and 3 power supplies (7 boxes)----its more spendy---$150k, Merging Technologies NADAC w/power supply and clock---much better now with the clock and power supply upgrades than my previous experience.----around $60k. I have enjoyed my time with the MSB Discrete DAC a great deal. - MQA decoding. It was a speaker setup (as in my signature.) You are using an out of date browser. Chord Dave Black New The Prime DAC With two prime DACs, MSB yields an unprecedented level of detail, reproducing the musicality, soundstage, and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you Ps Audio Directstream Dac Vs Auralic Vega Founded in 2004, Games for Change is a 501(c)3 nonprofit that empowers game creators and . Unfortunately not, I'm going the second hand route as I've done with most of my setup. Digital: Jay's Audio CDT2 MK2 CD transport, Modified MHDT Labs Balanced Pagoda DAC. I've yet to see a system with direct connections eliminating the preamp which wasn't improved by a adding a good preamp back into the mix! This would help to take your digital playback upa few levels. Vega DAC 6/10 As dynamic as the Weiss, but a little too edgy in sound emphasised presence made female voices a bit hard on the ear. Price 9k in the U.K. Perhaps you should consider the Accuphase DC-37 currently for sale in the classifieds? This is a very odd one to describe but came to the fore on tracks like Pan Eros from World Of Drums and Percussion. Hmm.. CHORD Dave could be the most expensive deeply design DAC in the world and if you find it not your taste there is the best off the shelf DACs like akm4499 in Topping D90 for 699$ that could be even better than Dave. MSB are an American brand headed up by the brothers Jonathan and Daniel Gullman and located in Silicon Valley, California where they design and build a range of amplifiers, transports, and DACs. When I have done the comparison with other DACs I have had at the same time - Ayre QX5-Twenty, EAR Dac 4, exasound e32 - often the immediate impression is that DAVE/Blu 2 is not quite as good - a bit dryer sounding, not quite as smooth, not as airy or three dimensional And yet, over the longer term, it is deeply satisfying at a musical level in a way that the other DACs are not. conversation. And differences at that level can be good. I called the distributor and we went through everything again. The demo model came in brushed aluminium but you can also get black. Thanks for the interesting reply, cmarin. @astewart8944--two years ago in Feb of 17 i did audition the original Formula dac in my system directly compared to the Lampizator GG 1.5 and the Nagra HD and preferred the Formula for its greater space, lower noise, and more neutral and fast presentation. Does anyone have formula for that? Search: Msb Discrete Dac Vs Chord Dave. ISOAcoustics Oreas footers. I just heard DAVE directly connected to MacBook Pro via USB without any expensive cables, headphone amplifier, power conditioner. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. With two prime DACs, the MSB Discrete yields an unprecedented level of detail that reproduces the musicality, soundstage and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. Looking forward to the your additions to the list. Will do. I thought the DAVE was just as stunning with DSD as PCM. Thanks for the suggestions Wisnon. Once complete there are measurements and functional tests before the final products are inspected, cleaned, and packed up ready to be shipped, but not before a white glove inspection by either Jonathan or Daniel. Cheers @Stereophilus The end result is a digital experience defying expectations. The only other items in the chain were the Stack streamer and a pretty well-sorted network setup. I would just add budget and the other components in the system are major factors to consider. Also, it is worth noting I heard the v1 DAC 2X, not the v2. Australian Business Number 38 650 151 296, Digital Sources, DACs, and Computer Audio, Chord Dave vs Mola Mola Makua/Tambaqui vs Emm Labs Dac2x vs Rockna Wavedream. and the MSB Select II has a huge advantage over other dacs with its modularity and in-house development which promotes, in a very timely way, keeping the product at the very tip top cutting edge of digital interface developments. What ice cream do you prefer? But DAVE also seems to me to highlight the original recording so if the recording is flat, the playback sounds flat (still with great accurate timbre) but if the recording really showcase the soundstage and the 3-dimensionality of the instruments and vocals, DAVE really portrays that well. Many of these were already in a shootout on Audiogon with the same requirements - has to sound stellar on 16/44.1 tracks: I agree that the DAVE plus Blu 2 is spectacular, but not in a "hi fi" sense. The only true way for the end user to know what they prefer is through listening in their own system. personal preference. Thats not allthe CNC unibody aluminum chassis provides the discrete power supply with optimal thermal performance and an elegant design aesthetic. This latter track is a good track for me to play when listening to new kit as it is basically a drum machine and an acid box and this latter did sound just like a 303 there in the room. Hifi Pig is part of the Big Pig Media LLP group of companies. Some silly sausage plugged a white power cable into a black device. Set up is key, cables are super important, server is also The DACs are individually shielded and thermally-bonded and multiple units are used per channel, which MSB tells us increases performance and lowers output impedance. However, there are also products that manage to straddle both sides of the electric fence (whilst being careful not to electrocute their nether regions) and give us a tremendously enjoyable reproduction of a recording whilst remaining true to the source material. To cut a long story short: A burnt in MSB Analog DAC with Power Base demoed side to side to a burnt in DAVE was no challenge for the MSB. But it need good system matching. There are some tonal differences too, but what you prefer will depend on your other equipment and the music you like. Fixed. Hope to try different formats on both DACs to see what works best in my system. The Dave as a DAC actually sounds decent. The MSB Discrete DAC is an American made Digital to Analogue Converter costing 11,000 plus an extra 1650 for the second external power supply. There is scale on bigger productions and intimacy on smaller-scale recordings and pieces, It wont make a pigs ear into a sows purse, but its majestic on really good recordings, Its very detailed but not harshly so actually, its a very easy component to fit in a system and live with, Its not cheap and you will want both PSUs once you compare with just one, No analogue inputs to make it the heart of a full system, You know that MSB have stuff that is out of reach financially and potentially better, Price: 11,000 plus 1,650 for a second power supply. It's too damn expensive, full stop. It's pretty funny how everyone gives their personal pet recommendation with the utmost confidence that the buyer will like it. I'm super happy with my Esoteric N-01, which is a noticeable step up in quality/musicality from the DAVE - as yes the DAVE sounds a bit "thin" (though extraordinarily detailed). I was upgrading it in this order and still could not believe every time it sounded better. I don't have that kind of money. There is a real sense of spectacle and scale when the MSB is in the system. So take it for what it is. luxury apartment hotels paris. The Discrete is a genuine high fidelity DAC and a fabulously built one to boot, add in the modular input flexibility and you have a pretty stunning product with excellent future proofing. I believe it comes down to Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile. "Im not sure if there are algorithms that can add high-frequency information that wasnt captured in the original sampled result". Now, this is an important and quite a cool lesson in what is going on with the two PSUs. What effect does reconstruction filter have? The formats that is used in comparison test is all 16bit / 44.1KHz, not DSD The Result : 1st : Select DAC II Full Option - 100% 2nd : Trinity DAC - 90%
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